To me the “There is God in Everyone” idea (However you translate that) means that as far as I am concerned, there is no difference in universal terms (or to translate back to the Theistic, no difference in the Eye of God) amongst non-member, member, and active abhorrent of the SOF.

However (and my understanding is this is one of the great contributions of Mr Fox), we are not living in the Ever After, we are living on Earth, and to the extent that we as humans don’t want to leave ourselves open to being knocked down by other humans, we need to “game” the system. And membership is that sort of game, or ought to be. Clearness committee IS largely a matter of “are you actually one of us?” but the answer is “yes” far oftener then nervous applicants suspect. Or it should be anyway…

Thanks for your kind words. It sounds like your clearness committee did wonderful work.

Timothy,

I know my response to the question is vague, hardly an answer to your question at all. That is intentional, and I hoped to to be fairly clear about at least that intention, if unclear in the answer itself. I truly find that a lot of wrestling over how we should decide who gets to be a member and who doesn’t, mostly unhelpful to the process of building and sustaining a loving community. That was a fundamental point of my post–perhaps I didn’t get it across. And I am truly ambivalent–not fervently supportive, not fervently opposed–regarding formal membership itself. I think some very good things come out of the process, the least significant part of which is the naming of people as formal members.

But I will go a *little* further here to flesh out my sense–still fairly vague–of what it means to “take part.” This taking part, to my mind, is not what qualifies a person to become a formal member. It is doing what we do. It is behavior, for the most part visible from the outside. We sit together. We listen to each other, and attend to the movements, words and images within our minds. Sometimes we feel powerfully compelled to speak of something that we have heard or experienced. If that compulsion seems strong and true enough, we stand and we give our message.

There are also boundaries of behavior–not of belief or opinion or spiritual maturity, but behavior–that legitimate participants in our community should not violate, whether they wish to be formal members or not. They are not firm or clear boundaries, but they exist, and occasionally in the life of most meetings they will be crossed, and we will need to find a way to respond.

To show up for worship, and pull out a Bible and read from it for 15 minutes Sunday after Sunday, would under most circumstances violate those boundaries. Or, again in worship, to repeatedly trumpet the certainty of eternal torment in hell for those who do not repent of their homosexuality. Or to pass out tracts saying the holocaust did not happen. Or to physically or verbally abuse members of the community.

Even in such cases we should proceed with care and humility. It is possible for us to grossly misunderstand a message or ministry that at first blush sounds depraved, and sometimes a very difficult message can contain a germ of something very important for us to hear.

These are just examples. There is no rule book; we operate by the spirit. And, again, these are not tests for formal membership, but for participation in our community, as a member or an attender. Formal membership, I would humbly suggest, is basically for those who have shown up and taken part substantially for long enough to develop a clear sense that they belong to the community, and want to take a further step in their long-term commitment to the community.

This is the traditional basis of Friends community and although I think it’s certainly possible for people of any set of beliefs to share that goal, even or especially with those who hold different beliefs, my query is, and remains unaddressed, whether people who do not share that intentionality are “taking part.” This intentionality of transformation is the individual and group “activity” that is sought and manifested through Friends Faith and Practice.

There is nothing you state, above, with which I disagree–but I don’t really know what you are saying. I do think that your self described evasion of what it means to “take part” leaves me still wondering what it means to you to be a Friend.

As we have already explored on the List–it is not only possible but true that people sit in meeting for worship doing vastly different things from what others are doing. Or is “taking part” what each of us doing whatever it is we are doing? If one is striving to be open to moral transformation by the work of the Spirit, in the sense of traditional Friends faith and practice, and another is reflecting on how much better the world would be if only Republicans would adopt the core values of harmony, simplicity, community, integrity and equality and still another is enyoying a vision portraying the beauty of particle physics, while a fourth is actively praying that gays and lesbians in the meeting be healed of their “sin” are they each “taking part” in the sense that you mean it?

(I suppose my answer to this decidedly NON rhetorical question is that it would depend on whether each is being conformed/transformed by what each is doing to the testimonies/fruit of the Spirit/image of God/ultimate concern. Cross, it is written, leads to crown.)

My own view is that when you come to grips with what it means to “take part” you will have laid down this vagueness and that you may find you are not so inclusive as you claim you are, as inclusive as you claim traditionally oriented Friends often are not.

Unless, of course, your view of being a Friend is that anything goes and everyone has to honor and respect whatever anyone wants to bring to the table. Then, still, you will find that you are not so inclusive as you think you are–because you will be led to say that you have to exclude those who do not want to include those who bring certain things–like, say, a self satisfied and unrepentent pedophilia or misogyny –to the table.

(and, by the way, Multnomah Monthly Meeting has had to actually face the question of whether one who brings unrepentant pedophilia to the table is welcome to “take part.” Not a red herring or an absurdity.)

So, I still don’t know what your basis for membership is. And I am not sure, yet, that you do. I know that you reject the idea that a certain set of beliefs is that basis, and I do, too. I also acknowledge and hope to help eliminate the pain Friends who have been subjected to that kind of spiritual “pat down” and subsequent rejection have been through. But knowing what you do not consider the basis for membership is not the same as knowing what you do consider the basis for membership.

If the community/relationship building is to be taken more seriously, as you suggest, then isn’t taking seriously the decision/criteria in regard to what builds the community and the relationships, and what destroys them, to be taken just as seriously? Or is your view that there is no reason that one could want to “join” the community that can be destructive to it and that anyone who thinks that’s not so doesn’t understand what “commuity” really is?

And, if it is your hope that the process leads to a realization on the part of the community that “membership doesn’t make sense” how does the meeting respond, with integrity and compassion, when, contrary to your hope, the person seeking membership doesn’t share that realization but insists that the meeting change what “makes sense” so as to accommodate them?

Hope to see you at FGC. We’ll probably do better, face to face, in discussing these things that we sometimes do on line.

Thanks for sharing these thoughts. They resonate with my own experience.

I was first moved to apply for membership in my Meeting about a year before I actually did so. I spent many months reading Faith and Practice to determine whether I was really a Quaker. This process required me to translate theistic language to fit my own views.

I hit a big stop when I got to the bit about trying to discern the will of God for the Meeting in business meeting. I can translate the word “God” in many ways, but there is no sense in which I believe in a personal God who has a will for Santa Cruz Meeting. At the same time, I knew experientially exactly what was being described, and I deeply believe in what it is that we do in business meeting.

I tentatively decided that I could substitute the words “in accordance with the nature of God,” or “in accordance with the corporate discernment of truth.”

When I came to my own clearness committee meetings, I was surprised at how little Friends cared about my beliefs or my accordance with stated Quaker principles. Instead, they met with me in a deep worship that was full communion and, eventually, a consummation of my relationship with the Meeting. The end result was not that the clearness committee put their stamp of approval on my membership application (although they did that too), but that together we came to a place of deep truth and connection.

I had expected a verbal test of my suitability for the Quaker label and instead was given a practical test in whether I could do what it is that Quakers do.

One of the strengths of our process is that the clearness committee is free to move forward as it sees fit. If there are serious doubts, the clearness committee can take as much time as it needs to address them.